Bass horn 816 good for home use?? Which model?

[Audio_by_Goodwill]

And why between this and their parallel flat walls it's best overall in a HIFI/HT app to use truncated 825/828 cabs..........

By truncated, do you mean a cut down 825/828 cabinet, or do you mean the horn of the 825/828 is truncated as designed?

[atilsley]

Thanks guys...I guess I'm trying to work through the trade-off of clean bass vs deep bass (without resorting to massive cabinets). I'm leaning towards clean bass...so the 45-50Hz cut-off is doable. I built a 5 meter tapped horn for another app, so I can do something similar again for the ultra LF's.

Analogue, what is the blue horn sitting on top of the 816...a Manteray? What driver?

If you were listening to a 'simple' two-way, would your 816/Manteray do it for you?

[GM]

By truncated, do you mean a cut down 825/828 cabinet, or do you mean the horn of the 825/828 is truncated as designed?

While the horn is truncated, I meant either scratch build or cut down an 825/828 cab to make a better overall performing 816. Guess we could call it an 816VII.

GM

[GM]

I'm leaning towards clean bass...so the 45-50Hz cut-off is doable.

Hmm, you'll get 'cleaner' bass with similar efficiency from dual drivers than a single in any of the small Altec mid-bass horns.

GM

[atilsley]

GM, noted...but simplicity/cost also a part of the equation.

I may go back to the large ported box using the 416....but I really want to try the front loading bass.

As an aside, what's your view on having the GPA Altec 399 2-inch driver (500Hz-15,000 ) vs the 1-inch driver 902 (500Hz-20,000) to operate in the wooden 300Hz Cogent/Bill Woods 300Hz front conical horn? Sorry to annoy people with this oft asked question....but I'm trying hard to make the right decision, without making this a more complex three-way system....

Perhaps I should just go with something like the 390 (300Hz - 7,000) and make the wood horn operate the best as a lower-mid frequency horn vs 'full range.' But then I need to upgrade the xover and buy a HF horn (eg JBL 2040/Beyma copy). My thinking is, if Cogent can build a classy two-way (albeit with expensive field coil drivers), then others should...think altec Model 19...!

Andrew

[analog addict]

Analogue, what is the blue horn sitting on top of the 816...a Manteray? What driver?

If you were listening to a 'simple' two-way, would your 816/Manteray do it for you?

Yeah it's a MR94B Mantaray. That 816VI originally was paired with a VIT, but I just don't think even the Mancave has the room to really make the most of them.

I have listened to the MR's and the 816VI with a single order simple cap crossover, and that combo can sound quite nice. I can't remember if Pano heard that set up when he came over, but I know another one of my audio buddies, the founder/former owner of Cary Audio really liked it with a certain cap value (which currently escapes me)

I've used different drivers on the horn, such as a 288-16G and a 902-8A. So far I think the 902 has sounded the best. Also, as I've mentioned before, the 515's in the 816's are a bit of an oddball. They're 515-16G HP's.

I recently picked up some Audax PR380 N0 15" woofers, which have a 97-98 db efficiency rating. I'm tempted to try those in the 816's or 828's also.....


Bottom line is that a simple 2-way using the MR's and 816's can be made to sound very nice indeed....:2thumbsup:

Have you dry walled the toy room yet?

What for? To make it more esthetically pleasing? I figger I can do that by hanging all my other toys on the walls, such as a few swords, pictures of scantilly clothed women, etc.

Besides, dry wall would increase the acoustic reflectivity of the room, and I don't have any interest in that either....

[Audio_by_Goodwill]

Bottom line is that a simple 2-way using the MR's and 816's can be made to sound very nice indeed....:2thumbsup:

I like the way mine sounds with the much smaller Mantaray of the 9864-8A, but I don't have the listening experience to the wide variety of Altec gear that many(you) here do. Come to think of it, I don't even have the proper crossover........ I've got one out of an M500 that cross's over too low if I recall correctly (info from Bfish).

What for? To make it more esthetically pleasing?

Oh, I don't know...... maybe less pink, and less itchy if you bump up against it.

[analog addict]

Oh, I don't know...... maybe less pink, and less itchy if you bump up against it.

To borrow a phrase from another one of my hobbies.

It's meant to be comforting, not comfortable....:snickerpup:

[GM]

GM, noted...but simplicity/cost also a part of the equation.

As an aside, what's your view on having the GPA Altec 399 2-inch driver (500Hz-15,000 ) vs the 1-inch driver 902 (500Hz-20,000) to operate in the wooden 300Hz Cogent/Bill Woods 300Hz front conical horn?

Yeah, well, you left that part out...........

My only real 'hands on' knowledge of the 1.4" exit drivers is with the 805/288B combo which I found a bit too weird sounding due to multi-cell comb filtering (at least in an in-room stereo app) and rolled off too much up high for my then youthful ears, so initially switched to 511/802 and later added a second one stacked on top to get the 'full' mids of the 805 and the extra highs of the 802 plus a better overall polar (power) response, and at the time, cheaper to boot.

Unfortunately, this isn't practical with round horns plus his don't appear to account for the narrowing up on axis that conical horns cause if the last ~1/3 of the expansion isn't flipped out like DSL's Synergy or Geddes/similar slow rollover, limiting its HF BW usefulness as a waveguide (WG) for me.

Not having experimented with this simple horn type and only having heard crude versions, I can't comment on how they sound wide band, though considering who design/makes them I assume they perform better overall than Altecs. Still, blending a round source to a rectangular one (assuming the 816) must present some acoustic discontinuities through the XO BW if sitting much off axis and I assume why Cogent's horn is either mated to another round horn or large point source in what appears to be a modest MLTL.

Does he offer any polar response measurements of this horn?

Anyway, XOing at least an octave below where it starts to narrow up seems a good choice for a simple/benign 1st 0rder XO, so the 399 would be my choice.


GM

[GM]

What for? To make it more esthetically pleasing?

Primarily to contain fiberglass dust, so some sort of fabric stretched over it which can add a bit more damping and esthetically pleasing too depending on what you choose.

GM